Suzan [guest] says, "okay"

Judi [to June]: "I was waiting for you to say ready..."

JuneAD exclaims, "Bernie is here!"

Suzan [guest] says, "ready"

BernieD exclaims, "Good evening!"

Judi shows Suzan the URL:

www.edsoasis.org

Judi says, "Hi Bernie...."

JaneBr says, "Hi there."

Judi says, "i was playing opening act...."

Judi says, "and showing people projections"

BernieD says, "I'm fashionably late as always."

BJB [HelpDesk] cheers for our leaders....Hi, Bernie and June

Judi says, "so they would know what those are like"

JuneAD has lost her link.

Judi thinks we ought to get started....

BernieD asks, "Cool... so we're ready to begin?"

ML [guest] exclaims, "Bernie I'm Irish - fashionably late is on time!"

Judi projects start ASO.

---------------

We always start After School Online Sessions (ASO's) with introductions.....

I'll start...

I'm Judi Fusco TAPPED IN's Community Developer and Researcher. My

background is cognitive psychology, and I've been researching and

developing online communities for 3 years now.

After we do introductions we need to make sure to give our attention to the

leaders of today's session and let them tell us what they expect from us

(the audience). They will let us know how much we should talk/ask

questions/listen.

---------------

Judi looks at Bernie

JuneAD has connected.

Judi says, "We're so happy you're here Bernie."

BernieD projects AboutB.

---------------

I'm a professor at San Diego State University in the Department of

Educational Technology. I've been working with teachers since the days of

Apple II's, and I love my job more than ever now that the Web is available

to us as a resource.

Here's a quick summary of some of the things I'm into:

---------------

BernieD projects the URL:

http://edweb.sdsu.edu/people/bdodge/professional1.html

Judi says, "our first projection....."

Suzan [guest] says, "I'm Suzan Gannett an elementary principal from NH"

BernieD says, "Astral projection on demand."

Judi asks, "New Hampshire?"

Judi exclaims, "Welcome!"

Suzan [guest] says, "yes"

Suzan [guest] says, "thank you"

Judi thinks she hears furious typing of intros....

JuneAD says, "I'm June in San Diego - I've been teaching online courses

about WebQuests."

JaniceF says, "I am Janice Friesen. I am an Instructional Specialist for a

program in Missouri called eMINTS."

BernieD exclaims, "Hi Janice!"

Suzan [guest] says, "hi Janice and June"

Cindy [guest] says, "I'm Cindy Matzat, a junior high teacher from Branson,

MO. I have recently been hired as an Instructional

Specialist for the eMINTS program."

JaniceF exclaims, "Hi Bernie, fancy meeting you here!"

JuneAD says, "Hello"

Suzan [guest] says, "and Bernie"

ML [guest] says, "I'm Mary Lynn from NY- Tarrytown area - Instructional

Technology Consutlant for schools in our area"

JaneBr goes out.

JaneBr has arrived.

TM [guest] says, "<Hi Bernie and June. Tom here from Down Under. Mary

Lynn told me about this session.>"

BernieD asks, "Tom March?"

Judi thinks Tom ought to get membership here.

TM [guest] exclaims, "I have it but I can never find it -- have you seen my

desk!"

Judi grins at Tom....

Judi says, "let me resend it to you Tom"

TM [guest] asks, "Thanks. Yes, Bernie. Long time, huh?"

BernieD says, "Yup."

BernieD asks, "Is that everyone?"

Judi thinks so....

Judi says, "speak up now or not..."

Judi . o O ( you can lurk if you want )

BernieD says, "Well... what a great group. A special hi to Cindy, whose"

BernieD says, "Radio Days WebQuest is one I always show to folks."

LynneM says, "I'm Lynne from enar Philadelphia. An Ed. Tech Specialist."

Cindy [guest] says, "hello to you, too Bernie. thanks for showing my

webquest"

BernieD says, "I didn't have a chance to prep as many snippets ahead of

time as I would like, so you'll have to bear with some

pauses."

BernieD projects Assessment1.

---------------

Ever since I began to be attracted to teaching more constructivistically,

I've been grappling with the assessment issue. Obviously multiple choice

exams aren't appropriate, but what is?

The first technique I latched on to was rubrics, and I still use them

heavily. We'll be talking more about rubrics tonight as well as other

techniques to be used earlier in the process.

---------------

TM [guest] [to <Judi>]: "<yes>"

BernieD says, "Let's begin by taking a look at a simple rubric."

BernieD projects Rubric1.

---------------

Here is the rubric template included as part of the WebQuest template.

We've done the work ahead of time of creating a table and colorizing some

of the cells.

---------------

BernieD projects the URL:

http://webquest.sdsu.edu/templates/TL/mywebquest/evaluation.htm

JuneAD says, "For those of you new to Tappedin - you move your windows to

see the page."

Suzan [guest] says, "we had a workshop on open ended questions just today"

LindaU arrives from nowhere.

Bhalobasha follows LindaU to here.

BernieD asks, "What experiences have y'all had out there in developing

these things? What's the hardest part?"

JaniceF says, "Sometimes I feel very repetitive in my criteria"

Suzan [guest] says, "I've worked with Advanced Systems on State assessments

to decide how to score math test questions"

JuneAD says, "Describing the different degrees of goodness."

Cindy [guest] says, "I think the hardest part is coming up with different

descriptions for each level"

Suzan [guest] says, "I agree with JuneAD"

BernieD says, "That seems to be the consensus with those I've worked with

as well."

JonathanBr has arrived.

Cindy [guest] says, "I agree with Janice"

ML [guest] says, "Developing criteria for the 1 and the 4 is the

easiest...it's the gray area in the middle that people

struggle with"

JaniceF says, "Also putting everything in a positive tone"

BernieD says, "It seems repetitive, as Janice pointed out, when you try to

lay out your benchmarks"

JonathanBr goes OUT.

BernieD asks, "Perhaps a three-level version would be better?"

JaniceF says, "I don't think so... on some things it helps to have 4

levels."

JaneBr has lost her link.

Suzan [guest] says, "our problem was more than one evaluator deciding

scoring using the same rubric"

BernieD says, "Well... these certainly seem to hurt people's heads to

write."

JuneAD says, "It's good though as it really helps them think about what is

important for the students to work on."

BernieD says, "Suzan... which would argue for developing more explicit

benchmarks (hard) to increase inter-rater reliability."

JaniceF says, "I agree with June....but it is time consuming."

Suzan [guest] says, "you're right"

BernieD says, "Let's take a look at some example assessments that may not

be so hard to write, and might (might!) still be useful."

KateMM has arrived.

Kate's recorder (recording) has arrived.

BernieD projects RubricOral.

---------------

This is a rubric developed in the early days of the Triton project by Linda

Taggart-Fregoso with some help by Janice Thiel who is now at the ESC in

Corpus Christi.

---------------

BernieD projects the URL:

http://memorial.sdcs.k12.ca.us/LESSONS/WWII/WWIIunit/oralpresentation.html

BernieD asks, "What do you all like/dislike about this one?"

Judi needs a sec.

JuneAD exclaims, "Ooh the self assessment column - that's cool!"

JaneBrody [guest] has arrived.

Suzan [guest] says, "I like that the student is asked to assess his/her own

work."

JaniceF says, "I really like the place for self assessment."

Judi nods and agrees.

JuneAD says, "Yes, that isn't done very often - I like it."

BernieD asks, "I wonder how Linda factored that self-assessment in when it

came time to assign a grade. What would you do?"

JaneBrody [guest] says, "Me? Sure."

Suzan [guest] says, "If the student was sincere, I would count it as 50/50"

Judi shows JaneBrody the URL:

http://memorial.sdcs.k12.ca.us/LESSONS/WWII/WWIIunit/oralpresentation.html

ML [guest] says, "I also find that students like a point system better than

the number...they want to know the grade"

JuneAD says, "Oh now that is difficult - to me it would be more of a deal

for them to learn from and change the next time around...."

BernieD asks, "Any other thoughts?"

LynneM has disconnected.

Suzan [guest] says, "June I like the idea of using it for growth"

JuneAD says, "It would make is easier for the teacher to write comments or

to discuss with the students..."

LindaU says, "I find it helps if the students are involved in writing the

rubric"

JuneAD says, "the teacher could see what the student was thinking and could

discuss where they disagree, I think."

JaneBrody [guest] says, "thanks, Judi."

BernieD says, "Certainly there's a meta-cognitive advantage for kids to

learn to see their work as we do."

Suzan [guest] says, "students could write their own reasoning for the

points"

JuneAD says, "Yes, LindaU that's a good idea."

ML [guest] says, "Linda I agree with you"

BernieD asks, "Ready to look at another one?"

Suzan [guest] says, "yes"

JaniceF exclaims, "ready!"

JuneAD exclaims, "that could be a lesson in itself!"

Cindy [guest] says, "sure"

BernieD projects RubricMusic.

---------------

Music is another complex performance that seems (at least to the layman) to

be hard to evaluate. Here's an example of a music rubric that isn't part of

a WebQuest.

---------------

BernieD projects the URL:

http://socrates.accessus.net/~dconrad/music-performance-rubric.html

Suzan [guest] has lost its link.

JaniceF exclaims, "Wow that is complicated. I don't think I could have

come up with it!"

BernieD asks, "This one was probably easy to write. Easy to use you think?"

Judi remembers things like this from her music playing days.

JuneAD says, "this one is difficult to comment on as I don't know the

content enough to be able to use."

JaniceF says, "Now that I look at it more it is very detailed. There is

not much ambiguity."

Cindy [guest] says, "For a music teacher who might have to score a playing

test, I think it would be pretty easy to use"

JuneAD says, "There are inconsistent gaps in the values for the different

degrees...."

LindaU says, "I believe that evaluation should be part of the

learning/improvement process...I have a hart time with rating

words such as superior, etc..."

BernieD says, "June... that's a key idea. What makes these easy or hard to

come up with is the degree to which you have content

expertise."

Cindy [guest] says, "but you might have a hard time justifying scores given

because of vague terminology"

BernieD says, "A lot of teachers have to teach things for which their own

knowledge isn't that deep."

JaniceF asks, "Linda, I don't know what would be wrong with the word

"superior", can you explain?"

Suzan [guest] has arrived.

LindaU says, "It defeats the kid who is "below average"....that kid should

be able to feel he/she is on a continuum toward

improvement..not locked into a category that can be

limiting..."

BernieD says, "A school that I do a lot of work with has grappled with the

issue of pointed feedback versus self-esteem."

LindaU says, "the first rubric that had beginning, developing, etc.. is a

better mind set for students..."

JaniceF asks, "What are good words to replace "superior"?"

Suzan [guest] says, "this is very exacting in its description"

JuneAD says, "Yes LindaU I see that now. The last column should just be

zero not 20% for no effort."

BernieD says, "In every case, they err on the side of self-esteem. I'm not

sure if they're doing the kids a favor."

LindaU says, "superior would be okay in the context of beginning,

developing, etc...but not in the average, below average

context..."

ML [guest] says, "I wonder if this rubric would be good if they (students)

used it to evaluate music they listened to. Might help

them in having a better ear etc. Then I could see this

being used- not offensive."

Suzan [guest] says, "good idea"

JuneAD asks, "Demonstrates creativity, mastery, developing mastery, no

effort, perhaps?"

Suzan [guest] says, "effort is important"

LindaU says, "the old "bell shaped curve concept locks kids into "what do

I have to do for the D or what do I have to do to be average,

not the concept of lifelong learning and improving ones

learning experiences.."

BernieD says, "Well... I think we're all (with the exception of musical

Judi) bumping up against a lack of content expertise with

this one. Let's look at another."

BernieD projects RubricHS.

---------------

This rubric is used to evaluate a HyperStudio project. Unlike the others

shown earlier, this one gives descriptions of milestone or benchmark

performances at each level.

---------------

BernieD projects the URL:

http://memorial.sdcs.k12.ca.us/LESSONS/WWII/WWIIunit/HyperStudiorubric.html

LindaU says, "it's not so much "superior that I have a problem with as the

bottom end concepts."

Cindy [guest] has lost its link.

BernieD says, "This one leaves "superiority" out in favor of letter grades."

JaniceF says, "I got an error...The file you requested was not found....."

Cindy [guest] has arrived.

Judi [to Janice]: "did you get the last l?"

Judi . o O ( html )

Judi . o O ( that will make a difference )

BernieD asks, "Did no one see it?"

Judi got it

JaniceF says, "I will try again...."

Judi [to Bernie]: "Janice is cutting and pasting"

JaneBrody [guest] says, "I saw it."

JuneAD says, "I think since the columns build on each other I would reverse

the order"

JaniceF says, "I got it that time. Thanks."

Judi nods

Suzan [guest] says, "Thank you for allowing me to participate."

Judi asks, "want a transcript?"

BernieD says, "Agreed... the wording is a bit confusing. But it's

cumulative, and that addresses the repetitive problem that

Janice mentioned earlier."

Suzan [guest] says, "sure"

BernieD asks, "Any other comments?"

Judi says, "if you are a guest and want a transcript please say your email

address. (now is fine)... if you are a member don't worry about

it"

Judi says, "we have members email addresses."

Suzan [guest] says, "sgannett@winnisquam.k12.nh.us"

ML [guest] says, "mcollins@lhric.org"

Cindy [guest] says, "cmatzat@hotmail.com"

JaniceF says, "janice@more.net"

Suzan [guest] has disconnected.

Judi . o O ( sorry for the interuption )

BernieD exclaims, "Not a problem!"

BernieD says, "Well... tempus is fugiting and I wanted to get to a

different aspect of assessment."

BernieD says, "In some ways, you might think of it as a step backwards...

but in this case I think that's good."

BernieD says, "One thing I've noticed about educators who move over to the

constructivist side is that they leave behind lecturing and

objective assessments."

BernieD says, "Some throw out the "everything we know about teaching" baby

with the bathwater, and I (as if you couldn't tell) think

that's a mistake."

BernieD says, "I've seem teachers give kids problems (in or out of a

WebQuest) in which they were supposed to do amazing levels of

synthesis and evaluation but no one"

BernieD says, "checked to see if they had enough content knowledge to

really do that without doing damage to the problem."

BernieD asks, "Does that jibe with anyone else's experience?"

JuneAD says, "YES!!!""

BernieD says, "Nice to have a wife who agrees with you."

JaniceF says, "It makes sense. We are all learning something new and go

overboard...."

JuneAD (Smile)

ML [guest] says, "Absolutely and then people say WQ don't work.

Scaffolding questions and tasks/activities are extremely

important when answering the Big Question"

BernieD says, "It's the standard story in education. Drop everything old.

On with the new."

BernieD says, "Well... I wanted to point out some online reaources that

would be extremely"

BernieD says, "useful for building in interim assessments in the middle of

a WebQuest."

BernieD asks, "The first of these is Quia. Is everyone familiar with that?"

JaniceF says, "a little"

ML [guest] says, "yes...just stumbled upon it"

JuneAD says, "I am - it's nice."

Cindy [guest] says, "somewhat"

KateMM says, "not at all"

BernieD says, "For the benefit of those who are here later via transcript,

let me show you a bit."

BernieD projects Quia.

---------------

Here's the main page for Quia (pronounced key-uh). It allows you to create

objective quizzes of two types and several kinds of games and puzzles.

The first type of quiz is a self-check, which seems very appropriate as an

interim step along the way within a WebQuest, particularly for older,

self-directed learners.

If you look in the right column under "getting started" you'll see mention

of something called "quiz sessions". That's a second type of quiz in that

the learner has to log in and the scores are stored online. This way you

can be more formal with the evaluation and the learners will take it more

seriously as well.

---------------

BernieD projects the URL:

http://www.quia.com/

BernieD says, "What most folks get excited about with Quia I think is the

gamey things. But I think the quizzes can be useful as well."

JaniceF says, "there was a long discussion on a list I participated in on

whether this is going backward with technology."

BernieD asks, "What do you think?"

JuneAD asks, "What did you-all decide JaniceF?"

JaniceF says, "I think that there is a place for this type of activity and

computer use also."

JaniceF says, "It would be sad if we never went beyond it..."

ML [guest] says, "Janice I see your point...but if we use this as an interm

assessment (not our main assessment)"

DianaF goes OUT.

BernieD says, "They've added a Jeopardy-like think called a challenge board

which would be way cool as a motivator."

Judi shows talk to MatthewH.

BernieD says, "Let's look a bit closer at the quiz part:"

BernieD projects Quia2.

---------------

Here's more information on Quia quiz sessions.

---------------

BernieD projects the URL:

http://www.quia.com/tutorses.html

BernieD says, "As you can see, you can identify which kids got which

questions wrong. It's a way to gauge both the kid's knowledge

and your own success at laying the content background."

JuneAD asks, "Can one see scores of individual students?"

JuneAD says, "Oh I didn't see that."

BernieD says, "Yup, June."

JuneAD nods

BernieD asks, "Any other comments on this?"

JuneAD asks, "I see this a very useful! It's a great service? Are they

selling something?"

ML [guest] says, "It's a great tool for a quick assessment of who needs a

mini lesson content they will need to complete the task"

BernieD says, "Not selling anything yet. No ads. No products."

Judi asks, "who runs them?"

BernieD says, "Dunno. Bill Gates probably."

Judi is excited to know about a new resource.

JaneBrody [guest] asks, "I look forward to exploring this. Would it work

for 2year college students?"

JaniceF asks, "Yes, how do they make money?"

Judi groans

ML [guest] says, "(Please excuse my typos it's 9:20 here...long day"

Judi says, "typos are ignored here... :-)"

BernieD says, "Jane... sure. We've all got an inner child in there

somewhere."

JuneAD says, "I haven't registered with them yet, didn't know if something

would start once I did : )"

BernieD says, "Janice... I think at some point they'll roll out a super

version for some money while leaving this one free."

Judi says, "hmmmm..."

JaneBrody [guest] asks, "thanks. Just an etiquette question: When I have

to leave the discussion, should i say goodbye or

just quietly leave?"

Judi says, "it's always nice to say goodbye... so we don't worry that

you'vbe been kicked off"

BernieD says, "OK... one last free resource for assessment. It's called

FlashBase."

BernieD projects FlashBase.

---------------

This is the main page for FlashBase. It's free to set up an account for

yourself and you can then use it to create forms to gather feedback for

your students' work.

---------------

BernieD projects the URL:

http://www.flashbase.com

BernieD says, "FlashBase lets you create a database that lives on their

server and helps you create forms to put data into them."

JaneBrody [guest] says, "sounds too techno for me."

BernieD asks, "No Jane... it's really very easy. You can create a database

in 5 minutes.So what does this have to do with assessment?"

Cindy [guest] says, "How is the data presented to you when you want to

access it"

JaneBrody [guest] says, "bye for now."

BernieD says, "It shows up in a table in your browser, or you can download

the data and bring it into AppleWorks, Excel, etc."

BernieD says, "Here's an example of how I've used it:"

BernieD projects FlashbaseForm.

---------------

I teach a course in which part of the grade comes from students mastering a

chapter in the text and putting on a 25 minute lesson to explain the

chapter to the class. The grade they get is based on that peer feedback,

since their peers are the audience they're trying to please and edify. To

provide the students with immediate knowledge of how well they did, I used

FlashBase to put together a peer feedback form.

I can show the presenters the results right away and later download it into

a database or spreadsheet for further analysis.

---------------

BernieD projects the URL:

http://www.flashbase.com/forms/Presentation

JuneAD says, "It has column for each question with the rows below showing

what someone entered for that item."

JuneAD exclaims, "Cool that it also has multiple choice and open ended

option!"

ML [guest] says, "Thanks Bernie!! I've been looking for something like this"

BernieD says, "So... as a way to facilitate peer evaluation, or evaluation

from distant viewers (if your kids produce a web page for

example) this can be very useful."

Cindy [guest] says, "this looks wonderful"

JuneAD says, "Or for answers to a test - this will be very useful."

JaniceF exclaims, "Interaction on the web is actually getting practical for

anyone!"

ML [guest] says, "This could be great for an online course..."

ML [guest] [to Evaluate]: "each other's lessons posted on the site"

BernieD says, "I'm using this for collaborative constructivist work, too.

Students are"

BernieD says, "compiling a list of resources and they're all adding them to

a common database that we can all look at."

BernieD asks, "And with that, we're about out of time. Any last words for

the good of the order?"

Judi says, "Wonderful session as always"

Judi [to Bernie/others]: ""

Cindy [guest] says, "Thank you for the useful information"

Judi says, "i actually have a question about this.... transcript thing..."

Judi says, "We keep transcripts of all our sessions in here for our

members...."

JuneAD says, "Nice information Bernie - thanks."

JaniceF exclaims, "This was really helpful. I have read transcripts and

found it easier to follow actually participating!"

ML [guest] exclaims, "Keep up the Great work. It's much appreciated by

those on the east coast! Goodnight!"

Judi says, "and one member last night came in and got some of the past

webquest transcripts......"

KateMM asks, "can you search the database?"

Judi says, "She wanted to share them with her students and I thought that

was fine... then she wanted to post them to her website for her

students......."

Judi asks, "does anyone have objections to that?"

BernieD says, "Not I."

TM [guest] says, "Nice to read your typing again, Bernie."

Judi says, "we're going to email the people in the past sessions to make

sure....."

Judi says, "they don't object."

ML [guest] says, "No problem here"

Judi looks around the room....

Cindy [guest] says, "no objections here"

JaniceF says, "no problem"

BernieD says, "Just cut out the part in which I describe my years in Sing

Sing."

Judi says, "if anyone wants their identity changed let me know..."

Judi laughs

JuneAD Ha ha!

ML [guest] says, "Hey that's a prison here! Not far from here..."

Judi says, "thanks everyone... that's it for me."

JuneAD exclaims, "My new name is Lolita!"

Judi grins

Judi smiles

JaniceF says, "Good Night See you next month"

Cindy [guest] says, "Janice, thanks again for letting me know about this."

KateMM waves goodnight

ML [guest] has disconnected.

Cindy [guest] says, "Good night"

BernieD has lost his link.